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Why is everyone on my rlist not shrieking about this? So far I have only seen one excited post, and that is ridiculous considering how many of us care about Doctor Who. But perhaps not everyone has seen it? So it is linking time!
Link: Q&A Transcript for the the Doctor Who NYC Primer screening! It is in fact technically spoiler-free; we mostly learn that Karen is on Team Fez and Matt is on Team Stetson, and that Moffat is still as evil as ever, and that Alex knows more than everyone else.
Excited flailing: an excerpt of the transcript:
Audience member #3: Whether or not this was ever an idea—what are your thoughts on Benedict Cumberbatch as the Master?
Steven Moffat: Well, as if my life weren’t complicated enough already! Uh listen, if John Simm could hear you, you would not live another hour. [audience laughter] I shouldn’t tell you this… but I’m going to. After [“The End of Time”] he’d been saying, “I think now that David’s left as the Doctor, I would have to leave the Master,” and he pulled me aside and said, “I didn’t mean that! Look at me, I’m fit, I’m okay!” So Benedict has to wait in line probably.
I don't even know how to deal with how much delight this gives me. On the one hand, I am quite enamored of the idea that Eleven gets his own Master for maximum delicious paralleling, but on the other, it's John fucking Simm and he can act like nobody's business; I'm sure that given the material he could easily do an escaped-from-the-Time-War Master who echoes and compliments Eleven in interesting ways. And there's no way I'd ever say no to more John Simm.
It does make me wonder when Moffat's going to bring the Master back, though, cos that makes it sound much more like a when than an if. And I'm honestly more than a bit terrified of Moffat writing the Master, because -- look, Moffat writes the Who that's in my head. He writes psychological terror, and plots that can only be solved by using the TARDIS as an actual aid to time travel, and about the importance of memory and of stories, and his callbacks to oldschool make me clutch my heart. He doesn't always get it right and sometimes he says things that make me facepalm, but I genuinely trust his storytelling to a degree that terrifies me, because at this point, if he writes in the Master and hits even half as many false notes as RTD did, I'll be totally gutted.
...I am pretty sure there was a time in my life when I knew objectively that the amount of investment I have in this stupid show was absurd, and was, like, only mildly pleased when Cornell said Shalka!Doctor/Master was canon, and didn't run around like a headless chicken of joy. That was ... 2009 or something. And then I remembered.
Link: Q&A Transcript for the the Doctor Who NYC Primer screening! It is in fact technically spoiler-free; we mostly learn that Karen is on Team Fez and Matt is on Team Stetson, and that Moffat is still as evil as ever, and that Alex knows more than everyone else.
Excited flailing: an excerpt of the transcript:
Audience member #3: Whether or not this was ever an idea—what are your thoughts on Benedict Cumberbatch as the Master?
Steven Moffat: Well, as if my life weren’t complicated enough already! Uh listen, if John Simm could hear you, you would not live another hour. [audience laughter] I shouldn’t tell you this… but I’m going to. After [“The End of Time”] he’d been saying, “I think now that David’s left as the Doctor, I would have to leave the Master,” and he pulled me aside and said, “I didn’t mean that! Look at me, I’m fit, I’m okay!” So Benedict has to wait in line probably.
I don't even know how to deal with how much delight this gives me. On the one hand, I am quite enamored of the idea that Eleven gets his own Master for maximum delicious paralleling, but on the other, it's John fucking Simm and he can act like nobody's business; I'm sure that given the material he could easily do an escaped-from-the-Time-War Master who echoes and compliments Eleven in interesting ways. And there's no way I'd ever say no to more John Simm.
It does make me wonder when Moffat's going to bring the Master back, though, cos that makes it sound much more like a when than an if. And I'm honestly more than a bit terrified of Moffat writing the Master, because -- look, Moffat writes the Who that's in my head. He writes psychological terror, and plots that can only be solved by using the TARDIS as an actual aid to time travel, and about the importance of memory and of stories, and his callbacks to oldschool make me clutch my heart. He doesn't always get it right and sometimes he says things that make me facepalm, but I genuinely trust his storytelling to a degree that terrifies me, because at this point, if he writes in the Master and hits even half as many false notes as RTD did, I'll be totally gutted.
...I am pretty sure there was a time in my life when I knew objectively that the amount of investment I have in this stupid show was absurd, and was, like, only mildly pleased when Cornell said Shalka!Doctor/Master was canon, and didn't run around like a headless chicken of joy. That was ... 2009 or something. And then I remembered.
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Part of me wants 11 to have his own Master especially if he's played by Benny because omg I just. I can see it and it's beautiful and just :3
But omg Simm! I actually think your right that he is such a good actor that, after he's got rid of the drums, he WOULD be capable of mirroring 11.
IDK. Part of me thinks that Simm!Master is too much of a reflection of 10 and that a new Master would be good. The other part is just going OMG SIMM.
(also: just caught up with Community. I just. I LOVE IT SO MUCH I CAN'T EVEN. Thank you sosoosososo much for bringing it to my attention!)
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(Yessss, awesome! Delighted to spread the Community love. :D)
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(Actually, I just desperately want some Three-and-Delgado dynamic in my Eleven/Master. It's probably way too much to ask for, but I remember before we knew anything about Amy, I was sort of going, "I want a Doctor/companion relationship that's a bit Seven-and-Ace," and Eleven-and-Amy is actually everything I could hope for in that regard. My ridiculously high hopes, let me show you them.)
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Alternatively, as an obsessive Who fanboy, he just taps into the collective unconscious and draws out trends...
The fairy-tale atmosphere was everything that I've been wanting from Who. My completely unreasonable trust in this series of Doctor Who, let me display it.
...you too have Thoughts about not-a-duck ponds, the Master, the Doctor, and sherbet? (they would be so giggly and conspiratorial and when Amy and Rory are introduced he's all 'this is my best friend and archenemy, the Master! he just escaped the Time Lock and he's a lot less crazy now, but you probably shouldn't actually listen to him, I can handle that bit' and Amy eyes them and says 'so, how long have you been shagging?' because that's what everyone thinks and only Amy is actually bold enough to say so. Amy and the Master get on like a house afire.)
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I would quite like Eleventy to have a new, matching Master, and I had a little bit been thinking about Cumberbatch because everyone else had, and considering he and Matt Smith are beffies it would be fun (actors who are friends IRL always give the best slash chemistry). Also, it would be funny if the Master got to be ginger.
(Though what I really want is Tilda Swinton as a femme!Master. Ideally with Eight, doing the Time War saga, but with Eleven would also be excellent. But that's just my pipe dream.)
But dude, how many Doctors did Ainley act with? I am a-okay with Simm being the new Ainley, especially if he gets good writing, because he rocks the good writing. And I could see him being good with Eleven.
I kind of suspect what happened was that, pre-End of Time, Simm thought, "Well, best to leave if Tennant's leaving - it's only fitting." And then he read the script and went, "An entire turkey? Electric skeleton? MOFF, I COULD COME BACK IF YOU WERE WRITING, NO REALLY."
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On the other hand, Simm as the new Ainley delights me beyond the telling. And hah, yes, I kind of suspect that at first Simm figured he would leave when Tennant would, as he's said in interviews, and then he realized that Moffat is likely to write him excellent Master material, and he promptly ran to Moffat and said he'd come to his senses. :D
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Just saying.
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All this means is that my expectations for Moffat's Master are off the charts, and either I am dooming myself to disappointment or sometime in the next year or two I am going to have a heart attack of SHEER JOY.
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1. Genuinely terrifying and/or psychologically brilliant in some way.
2. Cheekily compliant with both nu!Who canon and the spirit of oldskool, but going off in a different direction altogether. Almost certainly a more sense-making direction than hobo!Master eating everything in sight.
3. Somehow timey-wimey.
4. Held together by a coherent story arc with meaningful thematic shit and everything, rather than being a series of plotholes and dei ex machinis cobbled together with string, gleeful batshit insanity, raging UST, and John Simm acting the hell out of the part.
Not sure what to think about Simm coming back for it though. I mean, of course it's John fucking Simm and he could pull it the hell off and then some. And I would more than trust Moffat to hand him a script that lets him stay recognizably the same character but different, playing off Eleven rather than Ten. But. Moffat looks like he's staying as far away as the hell he can from reusing or referencing RTD-era characters or plot developments. Most of the creatures and settings are brand new, the Daleks got a redesign in season 5, there will apparently be classic-series Cybermen in season 6. It would just be fucking weird to plonk Simm!Master down in the middle of all that, especially if it involved dragging him out of the time lock because that'd rely heavily on RTD continuity. Now granted, Moffat could have something tricksy up his sleeve there--wouldn't put it past him, especially if Simm started pouting at him for the role. But it would be weird.
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Moffat looks like he's staying as far away as the hell he can from reusing or referencing RTD-era characters or plot developments.
I certainly see what you mean, and it's certainly true to a degree! But Moffat also had Judoon, which are Rusty's creations, and the new-design Daleks and Cybermen and Sontarans, turn up in Pandorica Opens, and while he retroactively wrote away a lot of RTD continuity with the crack, it's still acknowledged as there? So really it's up in the air whether he'd take Simm for the Master. I also know that Moffat fucking adores the Time War, so I would be unsurprised if he jumped at the chance to fuck around with it himself. :D
WE SHALL SEE.
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Timeid vortex of fucked-up high-octane OTP, mostly because all of Rusty's writing for me is a giant id vortex with plot holes and Bad Crack and Tinkerbell Jesus strewn around it like so much debris, and it kicks my need for fannish engagement into overdrive. And Moff doesn't, so much. The very brilliance of his writing decreases that burning need for fic and meta and fannishness--he hands it to you all well-constructed and self-contained and wrapped up with a pretty bow, and you'd feel bad fucking with it too much. Which is... not exactly what I want for this particular character, but wow, talk about first-world problems and looking a beautiful thoroughbred gift horse in the mouth.See, the vibe I got from the Baddie Space Party in Pandorica Opens was "Contractually obliged to have some Daleks in the series finale, you say? Well here! Have your fucking Daleks! And some Cybermen and Sontarans and Judoon and are you happy now, can I get back to my character-driven finale yet?" (Why the Judoon, anyway? I don't remember him pissing them off that badly in Smith & Jones.) Of course some RTD-era opponents would show up in a big ol' laundry list of old foes. But I still get the impression that Moff is keeping his distance.
On the other hand, you have a very good point about the Time War, and when you think about it it's right up his alley. What with all the tying spacetime in dimensionally-transcendent knots and the Horde of Travesties business and jesus christ I kind of want to see what would crawl out of that man's brain if he unleashed a Time War ep on us. And I'd be sure to book my spot behind the sofa well in advance.
(Sorry for delete/repost; HTML fail.)
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You are right about Moff keeping his distance! I suppose though that since the Master isn't RTD's starting property, Moff can do his oldschool thing and still use Simm to do it if need be. And ahhhh oh good god Moffat doing a proper Time War ep. SO TERRIFYING. WANT IT SO MUCH.
PS I have remembered I promised you a list of oldschool Master serials! I will try to get on that soon. :D
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(Oddly enough the only other time I've felt compelled to use the term "sucking id vortex" was with Balzac's Vautrin, who was also a Magnificent Bastard with slash teetering on a razor-edge between subtext and canon. And I only remember this because IIRC x_los made the same comparison in an author's note to "Heart Heard Of, Ghost Guessed" so clearly Vautrin is the Master in disguise.)
And now I really want Moffat to do a Time War ep. Or better yet, a whole arc with the Master and the Time War.
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Haha I AM GLAD YOU ASKED. If Simm can go from Saxon!Master to hoodie!Master just from a botched resurrection, while still managing to retain his ability to be recognizably the Master, I'm pretty sure that he can do a third thing excellently. As to how to get yourself out of that mess -- okay, presumably if the Master was pulled back into the Time War, there's plenty of regenerative/restorative technology hanging about on Gallifrey. It's not too absurd to assume that he managed to patch up the body he already had, got it to stop bleeding energy all over the place, that sort of thing.
And then he can escape the Time War somehow! My dream is that he comes out of it, if not significantly more sane, than at least more introspective, and with him and Eleven a bit receptive to each other. This calls for new Master stories, is what I'm saying.
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My personal theory is that he left a token of some sort on the other side, probably in the form of a bit of engraved jewelry, and while he's in the Time Lock, some, mm, compatriots of his fix up the whole spewing energy like a hand-beam-gun thing. Or, having been outside the Time Lock, he can follow his energy trace back out. I don't know! I'm sure Moffat will think of something brilliant, outrageous, and breathtaking, though. One should never underestimate the Master's reality-bending powers of crazy.
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