aria: ([doctor who] can't hear you)
valinor spider party ([personal profile] aria) wrote2011-04-15 10:56 am

SPECULATE

Why is everyone on my rlist not shrieking about this? So far I have only seen one excited post, and that is ridiculous considering how many of us care about Doctor Who. But perhaps not everyone has seen it? So it is linking time!

Link: Q&A Transcript for the the Doctor Who NYC Primer screening! It is in fact technically spoiler-free; we mostly learn that Karen is on Team Fez and Matt is on Team Stetson, and that Moffat is still as evil as ever, and that Alex knows more than everyone else.

Excited flailing: an excerpt of the transcript:

Audience member #3: Whether or not this was ever an idea—what are your thoughts on Benedict Cumberbatch as the Master?

Steven Moffat: Well, as if my life weren’t complicated enough already! Uh listen, if John Simm could hear you, you would not live another hour. [audience laughter] I shouldn’t tell you this… but I’m going to. After [“The End of Time”] he’d been saying, “I think now that David’s left as the Doctor, I would have to leave the Master,” and he pulled me aside and said, “I didn’t mean that! Look at me, I’m fit, I’m okay!” So Benedict has to wait in line probably.


I don't even know how to deal with how much delight this gives me. On the one hand, I am quite enamored of the idea that Eleven gets his own Master for maximum delicious paralleling, but on the other, it's John fucking Simm and he can act like nobody's business; I'm sure that given the material he could easily do an escaped-from-the-Time-War Master who echoes and compliments Eleven in interesting ways. And there's no way I'd ever say no to more John Simm.

It does make me wonder when Moffat's going to bring the Master back, though, cos that makes it sound much more like a when than an if. And I'm honestly more than a bit terrified of Moffat writing the Master, because -- look, Moffat writes the Who that's in my head. He writes psychological terror, and plots that can only be solved by using the TARDIS as an actual aid to time travel, and about the importance of memory and of stories, and his callbacks to oldschool make me clutch my heart. He doesn't always get it right and sometimes he says things that make me facepalm, but I genuinely trust his storytelling to a degree that terrifies me, because at this point, if he writes in the Master and hits even half as many false notes as RTD did, I'll be totally gutted.

...I am pretty sure there was a time in my life when I knew objectively that the amount of investment I have in this stupid show was absurd, and was, like, only mildly pleased when Cornell said Shalka!Doctor/Master was canon, and didn't run around like a headless chicken of joy. That was ... 2009 or something. And then I remembered.
daphnie_1: Sherlock with his magnifying glass against a blue sky. (Doctor/Master (default))

[personal profile] daphnie_1 2011-04-15 04:11 pm (UTC)(link)
I. CONFLICTED.

Part of me wants 11 to have his own Master especially if he's played by Benny because omg I just. I can see it and it's beautiful and just :3

But omg Simm! I actually think your right that he is such a good actor that, after he's got rid of the drums, he WOULD be capable of mirroring 11.

IDK. Part of me thinks that Simm!Master is too much of a reflection of 10 and that a new Master would be good. The other part is just going OMG SIMM.

(also: just caught up with Community. I just. I LOVE IT SO MUCH I CAN'T EVEN. Thank you sosoosososo much for bringing it to my attention!)
colourofsaying: (bloodyqueen)

[personal profile] colourofsaying 2011-04-15 04:56 pm (UTC)(link)
Oooh, I think that Simm would be a perfect complement to Eleven - of course I've been wanting the Master back since he left, and thinking about it, Simm!Master has all that playfulness, and Ten rarely played. I think he'd be a little taken aback and a lot delighted with Eleven. I also think they meet in Ludworth next to the not-a-duck pond with sherbet. Because it's a sherbet sort of day, and Eleven is all 'oh, hello, Master. Want some sherbet?' and Simm!Master is kind of surprised because Eleven is not at all surprised to see him (because of course the Master would escape the Time Lock, duh) and because he's a lot less explosive than Ten, more cheerful, more willing to sit on a bench with his nemesis and talk about sherbet and being less crazy (both of them) and then something explosive and exciting happens where they work together but end up as sort-of-not-really-enemy-things again because you can't just toss away nine hundred odd years of intergalactic stalking and passive-aggressive warfare over one little sherbet-and-running incident.
colourofsaying: (dignity)

[personal profile] colourofsaying 2011-04-15 05:36 pm (UTC)(link)
You never know! Maybe Steven Moffat is at this very moment lurking on this blog, reading about sherbet and playfulness and Three/Delgado dynamics, and he will think 'well now, this is exactly what should happen! Bless these crazy Master-loving fangirls for articulating the vague and fuzzy intentions in my brain!'

Alternatively, as an obsessive Who fanboy, he just taps into the collective unconscious and draws out trends...

The fairy-tale atmosphere was everything that I've been wanting from Who. My completely unreasonable trust in this series of Doctor Who, let me display it.

...you too have Thoughts about not-a-duck ponds, the Master, the Doctor, and sherbet? (they would be so giggly and conspiratorial and when Amy and Rory are introduced he's all 'this is my best friend and archenemy, the Master! he just escaped the Time Lock and he's a lot less crazy now, but you probably shouldn't actually listen to him, I can handle that bit' and Amy eyes them and says 'so, how long have you been shagging?' because that's what everyone thinks and only Amy is actually bold enough to say so. Amy and the Master get on like a house afire.)
innocentsmith: ainley!master pointing accusingly; text: I see what you did there (dw: ainley!master sees what you did ther)

[personal profile] innocentsmith 2011-04-15 05:50 pm (UTC)(link)
*EXCITED FLAILING*

I would quite like Eleventy to have a new, matching Master, and I had a little bit been thinking about Cumberbatch because everyone else had, and considering he and Matt Smith are beffies it would be fun (actors who are friends IRL always give the best slash chemistry). Also, it would be funny if the Master got to be ginger.

(Though what I really want is Tilda Swinton as a femme!Master. Ideally with Eight, doing the Time War saga, but with Eleven would also be excellent. But that's just my pipe dream.)

But dude, how many Doctors did Ainley act with? I am a-okay with Simm being the new Ainley, especially if he gets good writing, because he rocks the good writing. And I could see him being good with Eleven.

I kind of suspect what happened was that, pre-End of Time, Simm thought, "Well, best to leave if Tennant's leaving - it's only fitting." And then he read the script and went, "An entire turkey? Electric skeleton? MOFF, I COULD COME BACK IF YOU WERE WRITING, NO REALLY."
tei: Rabbit from the Garden of Earthly Delights (DW Red/White)

[personal profile] tei 2011-04-15 07:54 pm (UTC)(link)
...if Moffat writes the Who that's in your head, I 100% WANT HIS MASTER.

Just saying.
tenlittlebullets: (Default)

[personal profile] tenlittlebullets 2011-04-16 01:04 am (UTC)(link)
Oh god can you imagine a Moffat-written Master arc. It would be:

1. Genuinely terrifying and/or psychologically brilliant in some way.
2. Cheekily compliant with both nu!Who canon and the spirit of oldskool, but going off in a different direction altogether. Almost certainly a more sense-making direction than hobo!Master eating everything in sight.
3. Somehow timey-wimey.
4. Held together by a coherent story arc with meaningful thematic shit and everything, rather than being a series of plotholes and dei ex machinis cobbled together with string, gleeful batshit insanity, raging UST, and John Simm acting the hell out of the part.

Not sure what to think about Simm coming back for it though. I mean, of course it's John fucking Simm and he could pull it the hell off and then some. And I would more than trust Moffat to hand him a script that lets him stay recognizably the same character but different, playing off Eleven rather than Ten. But. Moffat looks like he's staying as far away as the hell he can from reusing or referencing RTD-era characters or plot developments. Most of the creatures and settings are brand new, the Daleks got a redesign in season 5, there will apparently be classic-series Cybermen in season 6. It would just be fucking weird to plonk Simm!Master down in the middle of all that, especially if it involved dragging him out of the time lock because that'd rely heavily on RTD continuity. Now granted, Moffat could have something tricksy up his sleeve there--wouldn't put it past him, especially if Simm started pouting at him for the role. But it would be weird.
tenlittlebullets: (Default)

[personal profile] tenlittlebullets 2011-04-16 01:39 am (UTC)(link)
The only thing I could possibly worry about is that Ten/Simm!Master is like my personal Time id vortex of fucked-up high-octane OTP, mostly because all of Rusty's writing for me is a giant id vortex with plot holes and Bad Crack and Tinkerbell Jesus strewn around it like so much debris, and it kicks my need for fannish engagement into overdrive. And Moff doesn't, so much. The very brilliance of his writing decreases that burning need for fic and meta and fannishness--he hands it to you all well-constructed and self-contained and wrapped up with a pretty bow, and you'd feel bad fucking with it too much. Which is... not exactly what I want for this particular character, but wow, talk about first-world problems and looking a beautiful thoroughbred gift horse in the mouth.

See, the vibe I got from the Baddie Space Party in Pandorica Opens was "Contractually obliged to have some Daleks in the series finale, you say? Well here! Have your fucking Daleks! And some Cybermen and Sontarans and Judoon and are you happy now, can I get back to my character-driven finale yet?" (Why the Judoon, anyway? I don't remember him pissing them off that badly in Smith & Jones.) Of course some RTD-era opponents would show up in a big ol' laundry list of old foes. But I still get the impression that Moff is keeping his distance.

On the other hand, you have a very good point about the Time War, and when you think about it it's right up his alley. What with all the tying spacetime in dimensionally-transcendent knots and the Horde of Travesties business and jesus christ I kind of want to see what would crawl out of that man's brain if he unleashed a Time War ep on us. And I'd be sure to book my spot behind the sofa well in advance.

(Sorry for delete/repost; HTML fail.)
tenlittlebullets: (Default)

[personal profile] tenlittlebullets 2011-04-16 03:02 am (UTC)(link)
Yes, yes exactly. Moffat pushes my buttons all over the place, and he is good enough at what he does that I can sit back and shut up and trust him to do it right and give me a good satisfying story with some narrative closure. But with Doctor/Master I do not WANT closure, I want a freaking id vortex of wanton button-pushing and kink-stomping that goes on indefinitely and demands I play with it on my own.

(Oddly enough the only other time I've felt compelled to use the term "sucking id vortex" was with Balzac's Vautrin, who was also a Magnificent Bastard with slash teetering on a razor-edge between subtext and canon. And I only remember this because IIRC x_los made the same comparison in an author's note to "Heart Heard Of, Ghost Guessed" so clearly Vautrin is the Master in disguise.)

And now I really want Moffat to do a Time War ep. Or better yet, a whole arc with the Master and the Time War.
skipthedemon: (utopiaglee by hamsterfactor)

[personal profile] skipthedemon 2011-04-16 01:52 am (UTC)(link)
I want Moffat Master so bad now. I'm leery of more Simm!Master though. John Simm is fantastic, but how do you write yourself out of that mess without a regeneration?
skipthedemon: (evil genius by <lj-user="indiexicons">)

[personal profile] skipthedemon 2011-04-16 02:44 am (UTC)(link)
Hahaha. I had, in fact, considered this scenario. I would *definitely* like your past part to be true. Some part of my brain is still, "......whole turkey."
colourofsaying: (defiance)

[personal profile] colourofsaying 2011-04-16 02:41 am (UTC)(link)
He's the Master. He's been crispy, a goo snake, and an electro-skeleton. I don't even know if you can count his regenerations. He thinks a good resurrection plan involves a cult, a ritual, hovering, and wonky blue light. Somehow or another he ended up near the end of the universe. If anyone can escape the Time Lock and being an electro-skeleton without regenerating, it's the Master, because he's just batshit enough to make it work...

My personal theory is that he left a token of some sort on the other side, probably in the form of a bit of engraved jewelry, and while he's in the Time Lock, some, mm, compatriots of his fix up the whole spewing energy like a hand-beam-gun thing. Or, having been outside the Time Lock, he can follow his energy trace back out. I don't know! I'm sure Moffat will think of something brilliant, outrageous, and breathtaking, though. One should never underestimate the Master's reality-bending powers of crazy.
skipthedemon: (master of cool by a_curst_shrew)

[personal profile] skipthedemon 2011-04-16 02:45 am (UTC)(link)
It's true, the Master is make of crack. Bless.