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OMG DOCTOR WHO.

Oh, they dedicated it to Lis. <3

Holy crap I think River is my favorite now. Aside from correcting bits of the TARDIS' disguise since Eleven couldn't do it properly (bless) she was just as at sea and shattered as the others, and she broke my heart a bit. Also, I really adored her speech to Rory; I love the idea that River's whole world was the Doctor, and she's growing out of it as she gets older but that he still left such a mark; it makes Forest of the Dead that much better, too, because it makes her actions there make so much sense.

I also love that Eleven inspired the statues on Easter Island. Naturally.

I adore everything about Rory (especially "let's do this properly" oh RORY) and everything about Mark Sheppard, who -- aside from Romo I think that's the most genuinely likable and nice character I've ever seen him play! I wonder why he wasn't allowed to get married. (My first thought is that he was in love with a Russian woman.

polarisnorth suggested he's gay. I like both of these.)

Re: Amy, I ... dunno. I mean, I really love her quiet intense freakout when the Doctor was dead, but I am very unsure how I feel about her being pregnant! On the one hand, it's a good and graceful way to write her and Rory off at the end of the season; on the other, I'm not sure I buy Amy pregnant. WHO KNOWS. Also, why had she and Rory gone two months without seeing the Doctor? Why'd he dropped them at home and run off? It sounds like he's doing that now? I know they had to be in separate places at the beginning of the episode, but I have no idea why.

Other things I am not sure of: the Doctor's death! I mean, it's quite possible that Amy has just stopped it and started a headachy paradox, but if she didn't, if things sort themselves out ... well, he'd better have a backup copy of himself somewhere, is all I'm saying, or the next production team will have a hell of a time with Twelve. Let's assume that the death is real but reversible.

And OH GOD THOSE CREATURES. NIGHTMARES. Are they officially the Silence? Or the Silents? Or some variation? Until I know for sure, they are Lightning-Skull-Dementors In Suits, and they terrify the hell out of me. Also, they seem to be the ones with the Lodger's pseudo-TARDIS! I am excited about that! I wasn't expecting it, although really it is a bit expected in the best possible way.

Oh and ETA HOW DID I FORGET THIS: Doctor/River, guys. Holy crap. They were getting their flirt on hardcore this time. I think I am really starting to ship it.

IS IT NEXT WEEK NOW.

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You have my thoughts!

Seriously I spent half of the episode going: 'Why did you leave Amy and Rory behind? I though that that wasn't the message any more? I thought that people didn't automatically loose their TARDIS pass when they got married anymore? Was that last lot of trips just a honeymoon thing? Why won't you explain show? Why?!'

Currently the only thing I can think of was that they decided to stop because they wanted to try for a baby. I don't know. They are still very young... Really not sure about the baby thing yet...

My thought about Mark Sheppard's charcter's marriage thing was that he wanted to marry a black women. Wouldn't that still be illegal then? Or just in some states. But being gay works better probably.

I watched the Liz tribute. So many teary eyed yet laughtery moments.

Maybe he did it so they could still have lives as well as travel with him? It didn't sound like they expected him to never come back.

It being a black woman would make a lot of sense, actually; I think it was still illegal in some states. I mean, I'm attached to the idea of him being gay, but the other is just as good an explanation.

I don't think I can watch the Liz tribute yet.

One of my first thoughts was that it was a sort of Blink esque thing. Like the Doctor had got them stuck in the past and he was trying to get the TARDIS to work and sending them messages in the mean time... I don't know. Obviously that isn't what happened but my brain goes to strange places when faced by a Moff opening episode.

Someone down below has pointed out that laws against interracial marriage were overturned a couple of years earlier so my idea wouldn't quite work. But I don't know that back them there would be even the slightest possibility of a gay marriage. Maybe the Russian works better after all?

They bought the kids on, well not really kids, but her co stars from SJA. Honestly nearly started bawling.

I think it was still illegal in some states.

I checked - Loving v. Virginia was in 1967. Of course, he could have wanted to get married and dropped out before then? But interracial marriage was legal in Washington, D.C. for decades before that, so ... it would be a little odd. Not that Doctor Who doesn't play fast and loose with history sometimes.

Or it could just have been good ol' J. Edgar Hoover being a creeper for some other reason.

*high five*

I don't think it would bother me at all if we knew why he'd left them behind. I mean, obviously he didn't mean to do it permanently, because neither Amy nor Rory seemed particularly bothered by him vanishing for a bit, but it was puzzling.

Re: baby, it occurs to me that after River saw the monster things she also was briefly queasy, so ... maybe Amy isn't pregnant? And blurted it out for some inexplicable reason? MAN I HAVE NO IDEA.

Oh, I like that explanation too! Heh, and my brain automatically went, "Mark Sheppard's character fell in love with a black man with communist leanings!" Oh self.

:-D Yay for fannish brain synch.

Exactly, them not being with the Doctor was just one too many mysteries for me. So it just bugged me for the whole episode. Which was annoying and distracting and not really necessary when there was so much else to worry about.

Yeah, I thought that about River too. At the moment I'm thinking that it was sort of an elaborate double bluff. Cause as soon as a women on tv says that she is feeling queasy you immediately go 'Oh she's pregnant'. But when River said she felt sick too then you start to think that it is an effect of the memory thing so it is a surprise when Amy does her big reveal.

I like that combination! Personal canon up until its Moffed next week.

My thought about Mark Sheppard's charcter's marriage thing was that he wanted to marry a black women. Wouldn't that still be illegal then? Or just in some states.

Not in 1969, no. The 1967 Supreme Court case Loving v. Virginia overturned all laws against interracial marriage.

Thanks. I knew about the case, did a play on it actually, but I couldn't remember the actual date.

Regarding the pregnancy, the List had this to say:

Doctor Who's Amy Pond is to fall pregnant in the upcoming series of the sci-fi drama.

The Time Lord's companion - played by Karen Gillan - will be thrilled when she finds out she's expecting a baby and can't wait to tell her hapless husband Rory Williams (Arthur Darvill) the good news.

However, their initial excitement takes a turn for the worse when Rory starts to suspect the baby isn't his, and immediately points the finger at the time-travelling doctor.

An insider explained: "Amy has been obsessed with the Doc ever since she met him as a child and started making her Raggedy Doctor dolls. She went off in the Tardis with him and left Rory behind.

"Rory is suspicious that maybe the pair got it on in the Tardis with before he finally married Amy. The Doc, of course, denies it's him."

However, the titular character - played by Matt Smith - won't be the only person in the frame as the baby's father.

Other potential daddies include painter Vincent Van Gogh - who Amy and the Time Lord met during the last series of the BBC One show when he became smitten with the flame-haired female - as well as a Dalek or even an evil Cyberman.

The source added to the Daily Star newspaper: "It leads to a big who's the daddy plotline."

***

A Dalek? A Cyberman? REALLY, show? REALLY?

Oh now that's just absurd. Also a bit annoying; I can understand that Rory's been a bit insecure in the past about his place in Amy's life especially regarding her relationship with the Doctor, but ... he wanted to go just as much as she did! He seems to like the Doctor fine! They've done this plot, and I want me a damn Team TARDIS that isn't a love triangle.

Also, um, as far as I know Amy didn't sleep with Van Gogh. OR the Doctor, for that matter. So unless Amy's ~virtue~ is in question, it's stupid. Indeed, it's stupid regardless.

Iiii guess I will hold out judgment until the show actually goes there.

They barely had any time with Vincent as it was! Most of the time was spent battling an invisible monster! And Vincent spent half of the episode not entirely sure if they were a hallucination. He liked them a great deal, but he wasn't sure if they were real.

And I know Amy didn't have sex with the Doctor. I mean, the one time she tried to kiss him, he panicked.

I want me a damn Team TARDIS that isn't a love triangle.

So do I. HEY. BBC. THE DOCTOR IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A ROMANTIC LEAD. CAN YOU TRY GRASPING THAT, PLEASE?

POLYPOLYPOLYPOLY EVERYONE SHOULD BE POLY

(merlin icon because it APPLIES TO THAT SHOW AS WELL)

I like this not at all. Please let it be someone fucking with the media/deliberately misleading them. D:

The Daily Star's a tabloid, though. Not exactly a reliable source.

I was wondering! Thanks, that is soothing.

Also I don't think it's even actually from the Daily Star. I can't find it on their website, and the only Amy Pond pregnant article that's coming up is here -- for Amy's Freaking Choice.

TARDIS totty Amy Pond will soon have fans asking: “Who’s The Daddy?”

In a forthcoming episode, set five years in the future, The Doctor (Matt Smith, 27) returns to be reunited with his assistant, who he’s left behind on Earth.

GENERAL ELECTION 2010: NEWS, POLLS, MAPS, GAMES AND ANALYSIS...

He arrives the night before Amy (Karen Gillan, 22) is due to give birth. But the Time Lord delivers some heartbreaking news – she must make a decision that will change her life for ever and result in someone dying.

You can catch Amy’s Choice on BBC1 on Saturday, May 15.

Also this I guess.

There’s also a big mystery over who is the daddy when Amy Pond (Karen Gillan, 23) discovers she is pregnant.

Amy’s husband Rory (Arthur Darvill, 28) might be interested to know, too!

THIS. The Daily Star just likes to make things up as they go along. Wouldn't put any stock in it.

...Oh, man. SERIOUSLY? "Who's the daddy" drama? Please don't do that, show. Please don't.

I assumed Mark Shepard's character wasn't allowed to get married because he wanted to marry a black woman, but Loving v. Virginia was 1967, so I don't know. Maybe the stigma was that bad for him, even after interracial marriage was legalized everywhere?

And omg those terrifying aliens. So so scary, IHU Moffat.

I mean, that's also possible; they might not have done all their research, so I wouldn't rule it out.

FFF THOSE ALIENS. NOT SLEEPING TONIGHT, TOO BUSY MAKING SURE I AM NOT FORGETTING SOMETHING I HAVEN'T SEEN.

OH RIVER. I adore River. Most of fandom hates her and I'm like '...but she's FUN.'

Also? I adored Canton. Couldn't tell you why I just did. The Doctor's 'Brave Heart, Canton' probably helped me. (OMGFIVEY)

Although, tbh, Amy is still queen of my heart. Damn I don't think I could love Amy more.

RIVER IS AMAZING. Seriously, at this point I don't even explain the process by which I came to like River: it is just a Fact. River Is Awesome.

CANTON. Thank you for reminding me of his name, actually; when Mark Sheppard is on screen, until I make a concerted effort, he remains "MARK SHEPPARD <3!" in my head. But yes! The Doctor's "brave heart, Canton" was AMAZING; I can't believe it slipped my mind. I love all the ways Eleven is like other Doctors.

Amy is ALWAYS queen of my heart. How is she so great?

> Also, they seem to be the ones with the Lodger's pseudo-TARDIS!

Being old-skool, I wondered if that was just set re-use. You know, like the Cybusmen that were supposed to be proper Cybermen from The Pandorica Opens.

Bloody good, wasn't it?

I dunno, I think the new!Cybermen reuse was for recognition, not because they couldn't have designed different ones. And I figured that the psuedo-TARDIS for the Lodger would be back, so I'm assuming it's deliberate.

Pretty damn good, yeah. :D

It was for budgetary reasons. I read this somewhere. They were supposed to be proper Cybermen, but they already had costumes for the fake zeppelin-universe ones, and in the same episode they already had to show every alien race there's ever been and then destroy the entire cosmos. I'm willing to give them a little latitude there.

I love the idea that River's whole world was the Doctor, and she's growing out of it as she gets older but that he still left such a mark

...Okay, that interpretation makes me 99% more comfortable with that speech. I wanted to like it because, well, RIVER IS TALKING, YAY and also it was just a well-written monologue, but at the same time I was cringing because River, of all companions, to be going, "The Doctor is my liiiiiiiiiife"? Just, no.

But okay, if I assume this is younger!River who's in the process of getting over that starry-eyedness and becoming the awesome intergalactic woman of mystery we know and love, I can accept that. So thank you for that, seriously.

I did seriously love the Doctor's speech "Trust you?" speech to her. Honestly, it just kind of made me ship them more, because I have Big Theories about the kinds of people the Doctor tends to fall for (and the different ways he falls for them). The short version of which is, "Having the Master as your first love would mess up anyone's libido."

Also the "My life in your hands, Amelia Pond" bit that followed was amazing.

I said this elsewhere but I'll be lazy and C&P. I recall River saying in Forest of the Dead, "He looks right through me, and it's shouldn't kill me but it does." Putting her line in The Impossible Astronaut and together with this one, I read that as older!River having thought she'd grown past falling apart when the Doctor doesn't remember her. Coming to terms with it. And she *doesn't* fall apart. But it still hurts like hell.

Having the Master as your first love would mess up anyone's libido.

Hahahahaha. YES. If you take away the Master's out right malice and meglomania the similarities between him and River are astounding. Iyt occurred to me the other day, that if Ten did actually get it on with Elizabeth I, he did it knowing she would come after him yelling him about hum being her arch-nemesis and trying to kill him. Also, ambitious, stubborn, manipulative, reportedly brilliant, excellent command of pageantry before her court. And spent some time in the Tower of London, albeit for political reasons. Hmmmmmm.

the similarities between him and River are astounding

EXACTLY. And I totally ship Doctor/Elizabeth I, too, for that very reason. (Well, and also because I am a Liz One fangirl from my childhood on.)

I think the Doctor still bears traces of having romantically imprinted on Koschei back in the day. Charismatic, ambitious, manipulative, creative, fashion-conscious, ruthless, dramatic, mercurial geniuses who bicker with him, understand him scarily well, and are capable of surprising him/setting him back a peg, but at the same time are just booksmart-impractical enough to potentially need him to rescue them now and then.

It works for Reinette and Romana, too. Not all of them fit every characteristic but I can definitely see a type, there.

Wow, I can't type today. In a hurry to read all the reaction posts, heh.

*nodsnods* Reinette and Romana do fit the mold to certain to various degrees. There's also an element in being practicals in way he is *not*. Complimenting each other.

Yep. One of my favorite River moments is when she makes the Dalek beg for mercy. I know some people hate that bit, but I do like her being a possible antagonist, or at least someone who does stuff the Doctor wouldn't approve of and sometimes can't be trusted.

...And, though I don't really think River actually is the Master (for many, many reasons) I can't help laughing at the possibility that when she went, "I'm River Song. Check your records," the Dalek went:

INQUIRY: RIVER SONG, ASSOCIATE OF THE DOCTOR
> RIVER SONG, ALIAS: SEE ENTRY: THE MASTER
>>THE MASTER: OH SHIT

Because the Master absolutely would make a Dalek beg for mercy, especially if he were freaking out about the Doctor being apparently dead.

...Or maybe that's just me.

People hate that scene? Whaaaa? Hmm, I guess people think if they love each other they must have the same values. I think the Doctor gets off on massive rows, personally. He'd implode in frustration if people actually did constantly agree with him.

That poor Dalek. I have also have had the scenario play through my head.

No, River is the Master is fun crack, but I absolutely don't think the show is going to go there. She talks to much about seeing him for the first time, for one.

...people who hate that scene are WRONG. Or, I mean, YMMV of course, but that was the moment when I stopped just enjoying her and possibly fell MADLY IN LOVE.

Also, thank you for that, because your dramatization of the Dalek's record-checking process just made me laugh until my stomach hurt. <3

Yay! I am glad to have made that speech better for you. And honestly, in general I'm not too bothered by River occasionally having moments of "The Doctor is MORE IMPORTANT THAN EVERYTHING" because, well, it's not like she ever lets the Doctor know she feels that way, and I'm sure it's not like that all the time -- she just let Rory see one of the vulnerable moments. And that's kind of lovely.

Also, re: the Doctor's "Trust you?" speech and the Doctor's type, ahahaha oh my god I love that. And the entire following thread. It is SO TRUE. <3

Time can be rewritten, yo!

My first thought re: Cantor was J.Edgar Hoover being his usual self, and I'm going to stick with that until and unless we get info otherwise.

I actually sort of don't think Amy's actually pregnant, but I think I'm wrong about that.

I do love the tagline from the next episode about leading a revolution, though.

Indeed! I am a bit anxious about Amy starting paradoxes and things, though.

The tagline about leading a revolution is GREAT. I am so excited for next week.

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Barbara Wright Does Not Approve Of This Bullshit.

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